Every guy with a family feels the urge to pack a bag, get in the car and drive. At least, sometimes.
A client told me that – a straight guy with kids. I don’t think it’s a straight thing, though. It might not be a guy thing, either. It can be a lawyer thing. Any lawyer with loans experiences the impulse to hit the highway.
When you’re “The Provider,” you do constant battle with the itch to hightail it out of town.
Who’s “The Provider”? It’s someone you morph into. A character from an Updike novel…or maybe it’s Cheever. Maybe it’s Mad Men. You become a cliché from 1950’s or early 60’s tv shows: Dad, who arrives home, pecks the wife on the cheek, tousles the kids’ hair, then collapses into a La-Z-Boy and reads the paper while the golden retriever fetches your bedroom slippers.
…Except it sucks bad enough that you’re feeling the urge to pack a bag, get in the car and drive.
I’m not saying getting married and having kids is terrible. That’s how you got into this mess – you want the wife and the kids. As one of my clients bemoaned, “I want to be a good father. I want to be a good husband. I just can’t pull it off with this job, and it’s killing me.”
The problem is trying to be a lawyer and The Provider at the same time. That’s the part that doesn’t work.
The basic principle, when you’re The Provider, is simple: you pay for everything. This has a certain seductive quality. Many lawyers get into this work because they want to be The Provider. Maybe your father didn’t earn much, and mom had to work and hated it. Or there simply wasn’t enough money to go around. Or you’re the first in your family to go to college or grad school – or earn six figures. It’s a thrill, making it up there, conquering a new plateau of stability and social achievement. You want to bring everyone else up with you.
Or maybe this is what everyone’s always expected of you because it’s what they expected of themselves. You’ll be like dad, or your father-in-law. They were The Providers in their day. They pulled it off. Why can’t you?
It’s easy to get sucked in. You’ll have a big house, a few kids – maybe some leftover cash to lavish on mom and dad. “Let me fill your tank,” you’ll offer, without a care. “You deserve it.”
The Provider wants to “have it all,” “live the dream.” That stuff.
If you try to be The Provider, you could wind up standing next to my client on the train platform at 7 am in a fat cat town like Greenwich or Stamford or Bronxville, clutching a briefcase, waiting for the express to Grand Central and your mid-town office.
That’s okay. You want that, too.
It’s later on, when things turn sour.
The partner drops a nightmare assignment on you, then takes off at 5 pm. Now you can’t go home. By 11 pm, you’re red-eyed and shaky in a mostly-empty office, fighting off a freak-out and trying to give that sonofabitch whatever it is he wants “on my desk tomorrow morning first thing.” The hours tick by. You ache for home, for bed – like a normal person. At that point, The Provider doesn’t care about the chunk of a purchase agreement that needs to be re-drafted, or that question about the indemnity provision that needs to be worked through. The Provider wants to collapse on the floor and sob.
When you call home to the wife to say you’re stuck at work, she sounds patient, but annoyed.
At some point, your dreams bifurcated. She still wants all the stuff you used to want together. But now she wants more of it. Another child. A bigger house. Private schools. A vacation with the family to the Bahamas. A Mercedes. Summer camp for the kids.
You want to sleep – and to quit this god-awful job. But you know you can’t. Ever.
This job, this miserable, thankless law firm job, makes her dream possible. This job makes The Provider possible. This job makes everything possible for everyone. Except you.
When you get home, you find himself yelling at the wife. She’s pregnant with another kid – the second or third – and you’re screaming at her that another kid was her idea and she doesn’t understand you can’t do it anymore and there isn’t enough money and you don’t want to go to your parents and ask for more money or let her parents pay for things because it makes you sick and why can’t she stop and think before she promises to buy the kid an iPad for his 8th birthday, you can’t afford it and why doesn’t she get that through her thick skull!?!?
Then you slink off, pop a Xanax and attempt to breathe. The bad feelings come – remorse for being someone you don’t want to be, the beast husband-father who screams and storms around the house and your little daughter looks scared of you, which hurts more than anything.
You fight the urge to pack a bag, get in the car, and drive.
You don’t respect the wife. Maybe that’s unfair. She keeps a clean house. She does the shopping. But there’s a housekeeper. You pay for the housekeeper. And the wife sits at home with the kids and does her little part-time job, but that’s it. When the weekend comes, she’s complaining she has the kids all week, so it’s your turn to take over. She needs to go out with her friends or she’ll lose her mind. Then, in the middle of the night, the baby’s squalling – and it’s the same fucking thing – she takes care of the baby all day and she needs a break, so you should get up and try to make it stop screaming. Like you don’t need a break? Like you get any fucking sleep? But that’s unfair. You need to cool down. You don’t know anymore. Is anything fair?
You have to stop yelling. That’s not you. Keep your cool.
Kids need and need – that’s what kids do, especially the baby. They can’t care for themselves. But she has to do a something more, doesn’t she? You’re at that damned, god-awful, fucking miserable lousy law firm all day and night and she doesn’t even know what that means. Why can’t she get it through her head you can’t take this anymore!
No one gets it.
How could anyone, who hasn’t been there, imagine the misery of big law? They think you’re being dramatic; it’s just a corporate job, right? The other husbands keep their cool. Why can’t you snap out of it and do what’s expected of you – what even you expected of you…
You tried lateraling into another firm. This job is the other firm. No one’s making partner. The new plan is to go in-house eventually, but they want 10th years (because they can) and you’re only a 7th year, and they want specialists (because they can) and you’ve changed “specialities” twice and at this point you know you’re kidding yourself: You want out of law. But you have no idea what you really want to do. You were a fucking Philosophy major, for Chrissake. Nothing else would earn this money, which pays for…everything.
You look into the wife’s eyes this morning and realize she thinks this is how it’s supposed to be. Her father took the train into the City every day and earned a good salary so they lived nicely – like everyone else in town. He never made it such an ordeal.
She’s keeping her end of the bargain. She puts up with you coming back after midnight and going in on weekends, stomping and snapping when you get home, refusing to do a simple thing like drive the kids to practice or get up when the baby cries – act like a father to your own kids.
The alliance is frayed. She’s living a dream that’s crumbled in your hands and run out between your fingers. You’re anxious. All the time. That’s the effect of a law firm.
You’re also angry, very, very angry. It’s supposed to be gratifying, being The Provider. But it’s like slogging through a swamp, covered in leaches. Every single god-damned cent gone before you earn it. Enough with the accusatory looks. No, I’m not accepting money from your god-damned parents.
The Provider fantasy doesn’t work – not for the lawyers I’ve met. Maybe an i-banker with fuck-you money can pull it off, or a rich doctor. A zillionaire partner. But they’re on their second wife by the time they’re forty. For most big firm lawyers, The Provider is a dead end. You stop wanting to do it, so you resent it. You want out of this box. Now.
You want to pack a bag, get in the car, and drive.
Re-frame your life as a series of conscious choices. Ask yourself if you want to be doing what you’re doing.
But… But….
I know. You might have to scale things down. Your spouse might not like that. The kids might not like that.
You’re not a golden goose. You’re a person, not The Provider. If they don’t see that reality, and recognize the price you’re paying to protect them from the real world, then the Provider might actually pack a bag, hop in the car – and keep driving.
========
This piece is part of a series of columns presented by The People’s Therapist in cooperation with AboveTheLaw.com. My thanks to ATL for their help with the creation of this series.
If you enjoy these columns, please check out The People’s Therapist’s new book, Way Worse Than Being A Dentist: The Lawyer’s Quest for Meaning
I also heartily recommend my first book, an introduction to the concepts behind psychotherapy, Life is a Brief Opportunity for Joy
(Both books are also available on bn.com and the Apple iBookstore.)
Reading this sent a chill down my spine. I recognize this as my current predicament, although it’s a reversal of roles, as I’m the Provider wife. Just yesterday, I was telling my husband about this overwhelming urge I get to leave my office in the middle of the day, get in my car, and just start driving. I don’t think he gets it; I’m forwarding this to him right now.
Me too. I CANNOT HAVE ANOTHER BABY who I abandon on Day 5 to go back to the f*cking office. I hate my husband, who hasn’t worked in 5 years.
I hear you. I was the provider wife for nine years and it nearly killed our relationship. In fairness, when I couldn’t take it anymore, my husband, who was a stay at home dad for three years, agreed to go back to work. But it was 2008. There were no jobs to be had. He found one, eventually, and I scaled down. But his career was in the toilet and he had to pretty much start from the bottom. We are barely making it now, but at least we have a family and kids who see both of their parents.
I keep reading your posts on abovethelaw.com and they’re beginning to make me nauseous. All you keep doing is dramatizing your resentment for a career you got into by making farfetched analogies to anything and everything. You are dissuading every young person out there from wanting to enter law just because you weren’t happy with it. Seriously, you’re idea of motivation is comparing a hipster to a lawyer and saying how a hipster is better off? Or is that just your way of crying about knowing a guy who was in a mediocre band one time? This has got to be a joke. That’s like telling people that they’re better off playing the lottery their entire life instead of working hard for what they want. Because that way, at least they can live free and smoke pot and wear tie die… so that when they fail, they won’t jump off a bridge. And then the one in a million who wins the lottery can rub it in all the hard-working people’s faces.
This is the problem with blogs like this. You’re a bunch of super intelligent people that strolled through Harvard and ivy league schools because things came naturally to you..and you said fuck it, I might as well go into biglaw and make good money. And then all of a sudden, when the work got out of control, you start bitching and telling everybody in world that its biglaw’s fault. When , in the meantime, while you were at harvard coasting by, there were a lot of people who were staying up all hours of the night (similarly to biglaw workers) to try and reach their goals. There’s always something to be said about hard work.
I honestly feel bad for the people who have to schedule appointments with you.
disgrace.
This is part of the problem with being extremely intelligent (with respect to school work). You don’t actually *have* to do work to get through school. No effort, just an automatic intuitive undertanding.
*Then* you get into the working world (law) and all of a sudden you have to do something you never really had to do before, namely put in a significant amount of effort and actually produce work product.
It would be helpful if you *had* to stay up all hours of the night to reach a goal. As opposed to success being automatic.
Dear @SS,
Many of us appreciate Will’s posts because we’re trying to process our own complex feelings regarding our big law jobs.
It seems clear from your post that you love your job, work really hard, can balance your time commitments with your family, and otherwise have a great life. I think everyone is really, genuinely, happy that it works for you. That’s the dream. That’s the goal we all want.
In the meantime, some of us haven’t reached that goal and are either (1) trying to come to peace with our current jobs; (2) trying to envision a new life without those jobs; (3) trying to figure out how to let go of the dream and establish realistic new goals.
Will’s articles and “farfetched analogies” are actually, sometimes, helpful in working through those complexities.
And, to the extent that those young folks that are dissuaded from entering into the legal profession because of a few blog posts they perused on abovethelaw, they probably wouldn’t have had the stalwart gumption to rule the biglaw universe.
Anyway, when you make partner (if you haven’t already) you’ll have fewer uncommitted associates to yell at for their unwillingness to work as hard as you.
Cheers.
—
As a sidenote, what I find interesting about the comments on this post so far, is the role-reversal noted from almost all the commenters.
This rant was brought to you by Tampax.
You are an idiot. The dream is dead. A lot of us worked our asses off to get to BigLaw, only to find exactly what Will is talking about.
The BigLaw model used to be about working reasonably hard and making it.
Now it’s about working young people to DEATH, night and fucking day until they fall of the wagon or get kicked off. The whole business model is built on soaking the life out of young lawyers who didn’t know any better for a few years! Partnership? That’s a laugh in today’s world – may as well buy a lotto ticket, it won’t cost you 10 years of your life. And even many partners are working 70 hours a week perpetually now – that’s not LIFE, that’s LIVING DEATH.
If you’re one of those folks who doesn’t mind spending your entire existence pushing paper behind a desk, hurray for you, you’ve chosen the right career. But for any normal, sane person, including many of us who worked our asses off to get there, the BigLaw dream has become a nightmare and a lie, and Will’s posts are spot on.
SS, thank you for your post. Every post on here has the exact same underlying message, and ATL absolutely loves to post anything with the same sentiment. They make me nauseous too.
Biglaw is clearly not for everyone, and a lot of people aren’t happy with it. That’s fine, and it’s probably fine to make a post or two expressing that. But every single time, even making up novel-length stories about hypothetical torn-apart families?
If there’s a point to this other than self-pity, I’m missing it
Not that I take issue with the content, but this feels more like john updike than a therapist.
Updike or Cheever. Also, The Man in the Gray Flannel Suit.
This is all too familiar, but I was the Provider and the wife. Biglaw nearly crushed me, as did a smaller firm, so I got out entirely. It was unbelievably difficult but, luckily, my husband is extremely supportive, so we made it through the tough times and are now emerging on the other side. Your columns are incredibly accurate and, for me, helpful to understand what all I was going through in ym previous life. Thank you.
Reading this made me want to die, and I’m not even a sole Provider. But if I quit or downscale, goodbye house, goodbye… all that other stuff. Plus, as the woman, I still have the “second shift”. Oh sure, they “help”, but nobody really gives a crap about keeping things neat or washed except for me. So every night I come home after 6 to another hour or so of work, and never get enough time with the kids AND get to see the stay-at-home moms heading out to tennis in the morning as I head toward day care. I kind of hate them. I just hope to survive until I can find a decent in-house position or we can manage a down-size of job for me. Nobody should have to take as much medication as I take to get through the days.
Wow. Got a bit choked up there.
You read my mind, except at the end. Maybe not having kids changes the analysis, but, dream as I may, I am NEVER going to get in the car and go. I love my kids too much, even if I only see them for a few fleeting moments in the mornings and a day on the weekend. Further, you can’t just down-scale your kids life for your own personal pleasure. That’s just wrong.
Yes, you can. I grew up wearing hand-me-downs as a kid, and am a happy, well-adjusted (well-educated) adult. Kids need you, not stuff, regardless of what they may say about it.
I don’t know.
I’m still annoyed that I had to go to a state school rather than the Ivy League because of lack of parental $$$. And you also need $$$ to keep up in college.
Granted, I still went to a T14 law school.
See, I did not. While my parents had to work, we were comfortable. Private HS, UG and LS (though in fairness I got an-almost full ride for LS). Family vacations abroad. Enrichment programs. I view that as the minimum I have to provide for my kids.
Is that vanity on my part in not wanting to appear worse than my folks? maybe. then again, I think my kids do better with my wife not working, which is something I never had (babysitters/daycare all the way), so I think it’s not all vanity.
Do you have kids anonymouse?
h-no kids yet. Almost did. And I can understand how hard it is for people to want to provide less for their children than they themselves had. I gave one of my coworkers a hard time, because he travels in traditionalist religious circles in an expensive area, and was kind of miffed by what he saw as undue interest in his earning potential. I pointed out that if these women thought it was their godly duty to be a housewife, and they grew up rich, why would they want to give their kids less?
My childhood involved (really, really, excellent) public schools, private nursery schools, a lot of after school enrichment, the occasional camping trip/girl scout camp outing, and a couple trips to disneyland. None of my sibs went to Ivies for undergrad, because of lack of money, not lack of qualifications. But those of us who wanted to, made up for it with grad education (my sibs didn’t do law, so they didn’t have to pay for it, haha). My mom also stayed at home, which meant my parents didn’t start saving for retirement/try to get into a house until their late forties. Eeek. So while I wouldn’t do it exactly like them, when I do have kids, I’ll probably try to pull $100-$200k at a more modest job, and keep the vacationing to a minimum, but the family time/educational extras to a maximum.
We are immigrants and I swore that my kids would never have to struggle the way I did. It took nearly losing a child for me to get out of BigLaw. But in the end I think that your kids get more from time with you than from all the things you can give them. My relationship with my kids now cannot compare to what it was when I was working 80-hour weeks. They want to spend time with me now, as opposed to crying for daddy even when I had the time to spend with them. It is worth it.
But then, it makes me feel like a horrible human being that we can’t afford to send out kids to an excellent private school nearby.
Fortunately, my wife had an unpleasant experience at the local private academy, so there is approximately zero interest in her for sending her there.
We will, of course, shop around for local high schools to make sure that our children have the best chance of graduating valedictorian to obtain scholarships.
Both her family and my family operate under the valedictorian strategic college theory. That is to say, that you find the *easiest* *public* high school to go to and graduate first in your class, monetizing it into scholarhips.
Worked for me, and my wife’s brother and sister. Granted, he only got a 75% scholarship to Duke, but still…
I’m pretty annoyed with the entire formal educational system. It reallly doens’t *do* anything for you. Everything important I’ve learned, I’ve pretty much learned on the job or on my own using the Internet, particularly in the world of finance.
For example: Housing bubble? Internet
Bear Market/Financial Crisis? Internet
Coming Soverign Debt Mess? Internet
Theoretical physics? Internet
International Politics? Internet
Anyway, with repsect to children, I don’t really see the value in formal education. It really doesn’t *get* you anywhere. The important thing seems to be to develop social skills/social network so that you can get some sort of meaning out of life, rather than just waiting for life to be over.
I spent most of my years in education bored out of my mind and learning things I had no interest in learning and being in a college I had no interest in attending. For example, chemical engineering? No interest whatsoever, plus I never actually adjusted to college. Law school? Very little interest. At least that was a little better than college.
I just want my kids to not be absolutely bored out of their minds and/or stressed, like I generally am on a day to day basis.
Some day, I hope to be able to make over $100,000. And I’ve been in law ten years. Although I’ve avoided major markets, so if I really wanted to, I could move to D.C. and make that much. Really what I focus on is my savings rate. Right now, I’m only able to save about $40,000 per year. Preferably, I would up that to $100,000 to $150,000 per year. I honesetly just want to not have to work, being that work seems to make you hate life.
I understand this article, believe me, I do. But here’s the twist, I am the Provider’s wife, only I am a guy. The Mrs./Big Law Partner keeps on climbing that big law ladder. It used to be, she would come home and do the recliner thing, and that was fine. Now, she comes home and hops on the laptop and does more work – just one more revision or let me answer these emails. Or works on one more “important” law firm committee. It never ends.
I got the “little” part time job – yes I am a lawyer, but bluntly put, couldn’t/wouldn’t hack the big law thing. I drive the kids everywhere, sports, school, doctors. I cook the dinner. It’s no easy thing being the guy who is the primary care giver of the kids. The schools still email/call Mom if the kids are sick, even if the school has been told 100 times to call/email dad first because he doesn’t have to take the damn train. So, she gets the call, and then emails/calls me. Other than this column, I have nobody to vent to, because I live in a Stepford town, and nobody really believes a dad can do all this parenting. My wife must be doing it, right? And here’s the kicker, I have asked my wife to quit big law and let’s just move. I’d like it. And the kids would like seeing her. So, I understand, and it just doesn’t matter.
Interesting and I bet everyone is jealous of you getting to play Mr. Mom, right?
All of this goes to support my theory that big law, small law, medium law, law school — all of it takes bright, happy, well adjusted overachievers and just ruins their phucking lives.
Seriously, what a shitty profession. but one is not allowed to criticize it under ethics rules, right?
Wow. Another Provider wife here. I’ve read this over several times and I just want to cry. Even in house now (after surviving the firm the requisite 10 years), I’m not sure I’m better off. There’s no in-house nirvana. At least, not one I’ve found.
Like JCH I often dream of escape. Still. Like Lana, I hate the other moms, the second shift work, and the feeling like everything I do is not enough. Even worse, I’m not really sure how I got here.
A therapist just like you exploited this same cliche to persuade my husband to “reframe his life as a series of conscious choices”. Well, now he’s home with the kid and I’m hammering it out in biglaw. It wasn’t the cliche that got me into this mess, it was an enabling therapist.
So what you are saying is that you would prefer that your husband be trapped in “this mess” rather than you, and you think you are entitled to that result because you are a woman. Damn that therapist for telling your husband otherwise!
Hmmm.
A therpaist who *created* a Provider.
Now that’s a horse of a different color.
That’s pretty funny, to tell you the truth.
Will says:
“You become a cliché from 1950′s or early 60′s tv shows: Dad, who arrives home, pecks the wife on the cheek, tousles the kids’ hair, then collapses into a La-Z-Boy and reads the paper while the golden retriever fetches your bedroom slippers.
…Except it sucks bad enough that you’re feeling the urge to pack a bag, get in the car and drive.
I’m not saying getting married and having kids is terrible. That’s how you got into this mess – you want the wife and the kids. As one of my clients bemoaned, “I want to be a good father. I want to be a good husband. I just can’t pull it off with this job, and it’s killing me.”
Well, life also comes with checkboxes.
College, check. Wife, check. Kids, check. Career, check.
I’m left with retirement and death as the final two. And that’s not for about 30-40 years.
I don’t think I really thought about what being “husband”, “father”, or “lawyer” really entailed. Although all of involves a significant amount of work. And that’s life. And it’s going to be a giant pain. Becuase it’s work. And work is very unpleasant. Because it’s work.
Plus you *have* to do *something*
Then you get into the “what do I want overall society to look like?” Which leads to the Provider-Providee system. Then you have demographics to consider. How many children do I want to have to have based on optimal population?
It’s more of a social ideal than anything else. What do I believe the ideal world to be and how do I best get there?
Of course, for me, it’s the 50’s model. Because you *need* a social model to target. Plus, when you grow up with the working professional father (who loved his job)/non-working mother, that’s how you are inclined to roll.
I can’t say I *ever* wanted to get in the car and drive, though.
Great post. Thank you.
Will, your issues with women are showing.
This post is such an unfair portrayal of family life as the source of pain for lawyers who feel stuck.
It’s facile to blame the financial dependents for the provider’s misery. After all: every day, single lawyers at BigLaw who’ve finally had enough just walk away and join a jam band, right? I call bullshit on blaming the family for demanding the big bucks.
Every family needs a provider. If the provider’s job is demanding, then one way to make the family work is for the other adult to take care of the house, kids, etc.–thus becoming financially dependent on the provider. The alternatives to that arrangement are fine, but not better in any real sense than the one-high-income/one-stay-home version.
If the provider is unhappy with his job, then having a solid family will be more likely to help him through it than make him more miserable. But if the provider is unhappy with job, marriage, children, living in Connecticut–i.e., all of the choices he’s ever made in his adult life–his problems run way deeper than drawing paychecks from Cravath. If that’s where you stop as a therapist, then your client has an even bigger problem.
“The alternatives to that arrangement are fine, but not better in any real sense than the one-high-income/one-stay-home version.”
Having balance is better for most people (e.g. some housework/childcare and some professional work, than all-in at work or all-in at home).
I am also a Provider Wife. My husband was laid off six months ago. Instead of finding another corporate job, he has decided to become a photographer. (His therapist told him that corporate america wasn’t a good fit for him) Thus, my plan to leave big law in 2 years is now extemely unlikely.
Unlike Role Reversal, my husband considers the kids my primary responsibiliy. Any help from him requires so much nagging that it is not really worth it. Although a recent trip to a divorce attorney, has encouraged him to try to do better. I see my kids 1-2 hours a day, sleep 4-5 hours a night, and spend most weekends cleaning or shuttling the kids to different activities. I would love to find another job, but with 2 kids, a house, student loans, and a nanny, I am not sure that I can afford to.
This post made me so sad. I don’t want to be stuck in this role for the rest of life.
then divorce the loser. its as simple as that. your husband wants to be the stay-at-home spouse while keeping the alpha male status which he falls laughably short of. i say you have a few flings while the paperwork is being filed as well. men should never be rewarded for such pathetic behavior. never compromise the well-being of yourself and your kids for this deadbeat. child support will make him find a real job but quick.
I second Law Student’s suggestion: divorce this guy. You’re working full time, your husband stays at home, and you *still* have a nanny? Ridiculous. He still considers you to be primarily responsible for the kids? Unbelieveable.
I hate to be harsh, but you have only yourself to blame for this situation, honey. In the words of Judge Judge: you picked him. Now either do something about it, or accept your miserable lot in life. I have little sympathy for people who choose to be doormats–especially those who have exit options.
Sorry, Judge *Judy*. I used to watch it before I went to law school.
shes not choosing to be a doormat. shes in a tough situation. but she should divorce the fool, if her situation is as simple as she makes it seem. she is clearly intelligent and empathetic enough to communicate her dissatisfaction w a family attorney, and if that wake up call does not work, nothing will. but dont be so quick to condemn her for the dilemma her husband put her in. its hard to leave a domestic situation with a full time career and full time child-rearing x2.
So funny to see women immediately leap to divorcing the guy when there are millions of women who have similar arrangements on the other side. Would you be encouraging men who make six figures to leave stay at home wives who want nannies or other household help, or would you be defending her and saying “kids are so much work, men don’t understand, he should pay for a nanny without complaint”? And for a guy who was laid off in an economy with over 20% underemployment? How many women say they’ll go back to work after they have kids and then unilaterally decide not to, imposing the role of the provider on the husband? Women, would you say those guys should divorce those women and leave? The hypocrisy is thick here.
Except that she’ll end up paying him maintenance on top of everything else. She’ll end up ferrying the kids around as a single mom with the little relief offered on his every-other-weekend, Wednesday-dinner scheduled visitation.
Or maybe she loves her husband and just wants a job that isn’t suffocating. Quit the job, not the husband.
re double standard:
your analogy fails and i note you assume i am female or otherwise on the feminist slant. it fails because i actually would agree w your role reversal IF the situation was the same-ie the stay at home wife expected her provider husband to do all the housework when he got home while she pursued a modelling career that wasn’t paying the bills.
so its actually a different situation; before you huff and puff, why don’t you reread the discussion and find a rebuttal that fits it.
Thanks, Will. This is one of the best pieces so far.
Actually that reminds me more of Death of a Salesman or Revolutionary Road. But I hope your next post is the chick lit version. There are plenty of lady Providers out there, and also plenty more who will never make it to the stage of loveless suburban marriage because women who make six figures and kick ass in the boardroom don’t exactly fit the mold of “ideal wife.” I agree the law pretty much sucks for both genders but in very different ways.
Another Provider Wife here. My husband was laid off the day I found out I passed the bar. It was ok, now he could stay home with the second baby we had been planning and work at turning his hobby into a career. After all he supported me during law school.
It’s now 3 years later and baby #3 is on the way and he’s still at home, no money yet from the new career.
My husband is great with the kids, but I am in charge of the night and weekend shifts so he can do his thing outside the house. My “mommy guilt” prevents me from doing any less when I’m at home anyway.
Does my Provider role get me extra respect at the Firm? No, I think it makes people uncomfortable. Does my role get me respect from the other Moms? Absolutely not, I’m a curiosity or worse – a selfish bad mom.
Sometimes I want to pack up and just drive too; but I don’t. None of us do, because deep down we know this is what we signed up for and we wouldn’t be happy staying at home. At least that’s what I tell myself.
No offense, friend, but why did you guys keep having children, if this was the situation? You could have gotten an IUD after Kid #1 and waited to have #2 until your husband pulled his shit together. I have no idea why having #3 is necessary or seemed like a good idea.
I am sure your kids are cute as buttons and you love them to death. But mo’ kids equals mo’ problems and it is totally possible to just have one, or two.
One of my friends actually made an astute observation regarding this problem – the tendency of people to have one more child than they can really realistically handle. There are so many great couples we know that were doing great until they just had that second, third or fourth child – and then it all fell apart. A big reason why my husband and I are stopping at one.
Michelle says:
“No offense, friend, but why did you guys keep having children, if this was the situation? You could have gotten an IUD after Kid #1 and waited to have #2 until your husband pulled his shit together. I have no idea why having #3 is necessary or seemed like a good idea.”
This is where I get into the demographics issue. I was just talking about this with one of the other attorneys in the office.
Lots of poor people who can’t afford children end up having lots of children. He ends up representing the drink drug-addled parents as a court appointed attorney, getting them stripped out of their foster homes and given back to the parents, who really can’t handle them. I’ve seen some pretty disgusting pictures of children with ulcerative wounds from repeated beatings.
So, we have lots of people who absolutely *can’t* handle children having lots (5, in this example) (and getting Medicare/Food Stamps – you can never collect the child support – sometimes you don’t even know who the father is) while people who *can* handle children and *should* be having children have 0, 1, or 2.
This is not going to end well.
Number 2 was long planned for after law school and I was glad that he was willing to stay at home so we didn’t have to pay for day care and have to deal with daily 5:30 stress of who is going to pick up the kids.
Funny you mention IUDs, I had one after #2 and guess what, I’m in that 1%. It “moved out of position” during the brief window between checkups and surprise! We can handle #3.
But that doesn’t mean that I’m happy every second of the day or that I don’t feel the same pressure as a provider as described in the original post.
[…] The Provider Every guy with a family feels the urge to pack a bag, get in the car and drive. At least, sometimes. […]
I like these posts. People call you one-sided. And actually you are. (This post is another example, not just b/c it’s another “law sucks” post but also very male-centered–ironic when most of the responders, me included, are female providers.) But what I like about your posts is that (1) I thank my lucky stars that my experience in Biglaw is not like others’–I’m fortunate that my colleagues are decent, my work is often reasonably interesting, I get to do amazing feel-good pro bono supported by the firm, and the amount of time I spend at work, while sometimes brutal, is generally more reasonable than other Biglawyers (I’m part time, though by real world standards full time), and (2) I am always reminded to strive for more in life. I’m ok in Biglaw for now. It makes me good money which helps me buy my freedom (student debt, mortgage, family expenses, kids). But these posts remind me to keep an eye out for what I’m meant to do, which is not this. I actually don’t mind doing this for now–do not hate it, do not feel abused, like the prestige and money. So I’m ok to bide my time. But I like to be reminded every now again, as I am by these posts, that I should keep hoping and striving for more. Keeps things in perspective.
Will,
I, like many here, am a regular ATL reader. I’ve seen your columns for a while now, and to tell you the truth, a lot of them have seemed over-the-top melodramatic and whiny. I thought they were you expiating your own frustrations about your own experiences at your own firm, using some of your clients (who you acknowledged recently were a biased sample) to make your posts into something more than personal, isolated anecdotes.
Not this time. This story really hit home for me. Don’t get me wrong– I don’t have kids, I’m not married. But the experience of The Provider resonated deeply, as I read it. You’re exactly right about the culture of the workplace (at least in Biglaw) shifting so many burdens onto associates that they can’t also balance their work obligations alongside their responsibilities in a relationship.
I wonder, though, if this message has greater cultural significance. If “Providers” in other industries suffer the same way. Coal miners, accountants, cops, medical residents, construction workers– do they all struggle under the weight of escalating professional demands, only to come home to face familial demands? They can’t complain that there’s anything inherently unfair about the division of labor and responsibility in the family; feminism has long since cornered the market on that gripe for women alone. They’re the men, the providers– they need to shut up and be men, to do it like their fathers did.
Anyways. I don’t mean to hijack your message with an unrelated political riff. I just wanted to say that, to be frank, I dismissed many of your depictions of Biglaw and its effects on lawyers. But not this one. Well done.
I’m an anesthesia resident about to enter the real world of private practice. Although my situation is different from many here (no kids, still dependent on parents somewhat), I think law is far worse for the work/life balance than medicine. This was not the case 30 years ago when my dad worked 100 hour weeks with 30 hour calls. With federally mandated work hour limits (80h/wk, 30h call max) our lives have gotten much better outside of the hospital.
Admittedly, I’m lucky to be at program where resident life is a priority. In 4 years I have only hit 80 hours a single time, and my calls are always 24h or less. I’ve never felt abused or taken advatage of even once.
This is in vast contrast to my girlfriend in Biglaw. She not only works more hours at the office than I do, but is seemingly on call 24/7 with her blackberry as likely to buzz, with some assignment from a partner, at midnight on Saturday as at noon on Monday.
To me, it’s the always being on call that makes Law so much worse. When I leave the hospital I am done. This is somewhat exclusive to Anesthesia and Emergency Medicine of course, as we don’t maintain long term relationships with our patients, and don’t have to be called back into the hospital if were not actually on call. But, regardless of field (though surgery is close to biglaw misery), I still think medicine is more is more conducive to enjoying life than a job where you live in constant fear both of your phone and of the thousand people lined up to take your job the second you decide to say no.
Most feminists don’t think it is fair to put the emphasis on men earning all of the money.
In fact, it was feminism that eventually made me realize that even though my job means a lot to me, my male friends feel that their ability to earn and keep up in the workplace is tied in with their gender identity. And they are right. No one is going to call me unfeminine if I quit biglaw. But when men do it, people do wonder whether they aren’t quite manly enough. The reason I realized this was because learning to view things through the lens of shared experience (what we all have in common) vs. experiences that are more common to women (the whole feminist thing), I started trying to figure out what pressures/experiences fell more heavily on my guy friends.
Well, our sexist society shows in these threads. Only women can be a provider and leave that role at will. The men are truly stuck. Women have it made.
I’m female and can’t leave, because I grew up in a neighborhood full of bored, angry, resentful housewives (who 1) believed they were entitled to stay at home and 2) then found that they were bored, any talents or abilities went unused when the kids were out in school and 3) they didn’t have economic power and freedom or respect from working society). What’s the alternative? Give up stress and economic power for stress and my couch and “women’s group”? That’s not acceptable, ergo I’m not leaving the workforce (law firm sure, workforce no way).
Uh, I think you completely missed the point. The Provider doesn’t have the option to “Give up stress and economic power for stress and my couch and women’s group” unless he’s okay with pulling the wife and kids down with him. Thinking you can’t quit because you might get bored is a lot better than knowing you can’t quit because it would mean you’d have to sell your house, put your kids in a rougher school, and/or have your wife lose all respect for you (as illustrated by the enlightened lady-providers above).
Just wanted to throw my hat in as another female provider stuck in biglaw. My stay-at-home husband can’t understand why I worry about money or debt with the salary I’m paid. I am basically a wage slave, and the more debt we rack up, the longer my indentured servitude will be. I worry about money because each dollar wasted represents a small piece of my future freedom.
Great post.
Take this nightmare one step further. Try to imagine the stress of big law without the financial rewards. The recent Newsweek article about the Beached White Male describes me perfectly. Here I am after nearly thirty years of a a decent solo practice in the country wondering where my next meal is coming from. There is something radically wrong with the legal profession in my humble opinion, but maybe I am just a whining spoiled guy.
Hey everyone, look, patriarchy hurts men, too!
Will, any insight on the number of Provider Wives writing in? I realize in any story like this you kind of have to pick a gender for your protagonist, and it has typically been the husband who is the Provider (and I do think there’s a certain pressure unique to men to conform to a past ideal since the Provider Wife has no real counterpart in our past and so has more leeway to make it up as she goes along). But it seems that if the pressure is there, it doesn’t really matter who’s the husband and who’s the wife (or, obviously who’s the husband and who’s the other husband, or who’s whe wife and who’s the other wife).
I’m betting that most of Will’s readers are women, and a lot of them are lawyers.
So of the ~37 comments here, the vast majority are women complaining about their Provider Wife role, complaining about things being “even harder” for them, complaining that the original post didn’t include them.
I think that’s very telling. First, given the the majority of providers out there, especially in the legal field, are men, I think this shows the extent to which women are encouraged to complain about their lot in life, while men are socialized to just keep quiet and endure whatever hardships or indignities are heaped on them. Second, it seems to reflect the knee-jerk reactions of women to protect their monopoly on claims to beleaguered, downtrodden status whenever it’s in the smallest way challenged.
How sad for the many, many men out there trapped in the provider role who are told by society, as surely they would be by many of these commenters, that they have no right to complain. To whom should they turn? Not to their families, because to “downsize” to protect their own quality of life is, apparently, unfair to the wife and kids and an emblem of shame in the hierarchy of male values hung around their necks like an albatross. Not to society at large, because there are no resources or support programs in place to support them, and if even if there were, it’s apparently misogynistic to complain about feeling pressured by one’s family to maintain a role that you’re uncomfortable with. And not even to their therapist, since apparently even the therapist is made the object of resentment for enabling the provider man in shirking his responsibilities.
Which men are these that toil without complaint? Do you know them?
Providing for a family is hard and stressful, no matter who does it. If a lawyer wants to downsize his or her job, it might mean less time at the office. It will also mean less money, which will correlate with different kinds of stress. My husband and I are biglaw escapees and I know what I’m talking about. Just for instance, we don’t spend nights at the office; we spend them cleaning the house because we can’t afford a housekeeper. I’m not complaining, we made our choices, but that’s the deal. Life means work. Deal with it.
This business of blaming the provider’s family–so many mouths to feed, tuitions to pay, backs to clothe–is an easy way for the lawyer to externalize his (or her) unhappiness. The therapist is doing a poor job for his client by enabling the fantasy that the client’s family commitments are the source of his unhappiness.
Mother, you’re generalizing. The question is whether the lawyer can change jobs to something that pays a lot less and doesn’t make him want to kill himself or abandon his life altogether – this will no doubt impose some difficulty on the family and if they’re willing to jointly sacrifice, it can be salvaged.
On the other hand, a lot of spouses are not really willing to do that and will fight to keep the lawyer at a job he despises so they can keep that housekeeper and the spa appointment every Tuesday.
Well, usually if a man has a stay at home wife, she looks after the kids, the bills, the finances, and all kinds of other things. Most of the women who are complaining here don’t have that kind of support from their spouses.
I have to say I am one of the lucky ones–when I was earning more, my partner was really supportive about it, and he made his own money, and we mostly live the lifestyle we could support if we both earned what he did. Not everyone is so nice.
The male providers have a right to complain, too, of course. In fact, it is feminism that says that no role should be forced on either sex. So I am sympathetic to the men I know whose wives run through the money and won’t go back to work. (Okay, fortunately, I don’t know many like that.) But hell, even those wives look after the kids.
[…] The Provider « The People's Therapist […]
I find the responses almost as fascinating as the article. Feminism told women they could have the powerful job, the family, and the nice home. Apparently, it never told them how sh!tty your life becomes when you try to “have it all”, as something will eventually give. Did all these women “providers” think they could have a 100k job, 3 kids, and still go to yoga classes, watch sex and the city, and go out drinking chocolatinis on the weekends with their friends.
I am also fascinated by the fact that the woman “provider” status seems to be the new status quo. Most of the younger non-lawyers I know in other circles all have “blue collar” jobs while their wifes are all doctors, accountants, physical therapists, bankers, and lawyers. Complete role reversal due to the emasculation of men over the last 3 decades. These “provider women” moan about the fact that their stay at home husbands wont do anything…..but they never did anything. Women did not marry all of these “sensitive” metro, play station-playing, former art majors because of their work ethic.
Being “the provider” sucks. There is no way around that. Once you grow up and have a family, you quickly learn why your own dad was pissed off all the time, yelling about the lights being on, the heat too high, and why he never wanted to do anything excepr sleep. Providing for people who look at what you give them as an entitlement, and show nothing but distain for what you must do to keep bringing home the bread is a recipe for self-loathing, depression, and anger management issues.
The more important issue here however is that law firm practice/expectations is still based on the 1950s social cliche. Working 2000 a year might fly if you have a stay at home wife, a nanny, maid, and gardener, who do all of your housework so you can focus on nothing but work. But if you have two people working 60+ hours a week who come home to screaming ungrateful kids raised by some college dropout daycare provider and who have to figure out how to fix the burst pipe themselves because they cant afford to take a day off for a plumber to come over…..either the job, the marriage, the family, or all 3 will eventually fail.
Like I said, you have to pick a model. And I went with the 50s model, working father, stay at home mother. It seems to be best for the children if you have someone specializing in maternity and actually paying attention to the children.
Also, I have a wife more interested in hypersaving than spending, so I’m the one who gets complained at when I turn the heat up too much or leave the lights on. The debate in our house is whether we will save 50% of gross income or 40% of gross income.
Granted my father was generally in a wonderful mood. But that had more to do with the fact tht he was quite content to run a school as a principal and then as a superintendent. He loved the attention.
He also didn’t care about how much money he spent because he got a nice raise every year and a state pension based off of his last few years of work.
I don’t understand the nasty tone toward the Provider women. I only see people echoing what the article says. If women are going off and getting all the high-paying, crappy jobs and their husbands are now free to take lower-stress, lower-paying jobs, why is that a bad thing, Disgruntled Senior Associate? My high paying job means my husband is able to pursue something he finds more rewarding than the law practice he left behind. But I don’t think he’d ever say he feels emasculated. He could keep working those crushing hours if he felt his manhood needed it, but luckily he’s smart enough to realize he’s man enough without the depression, high blood pressure, and heart issues his last job caused. Freedom is not a zero-sum game; just because women have more respect in public doesn’t mean men have less.
Ultimately, I don’t see any of these issues as a BigLaw thing, a money thing, or a status thing. I see all of this as a marriage thing. If a couple builds their life on the assumption that spouse A is going to earn $250,000k+ working at job X while spouse B will stay home with the kids, then undoing that structure is going to take some work. But spouse B can no more insist unilaterally that spouse A compromise physical/emotional/psychological health to keep that lifestyle than spouse A can decide at 3:00pm on a Tuesday that s/he isn’t doing one more 6 minute increment of this shit and head out the door. This seems to really be about a couple that needs to sit down and map out a plan where spouse A says, honestly, “I can do this job for X more months” while spouse B says “I can cut back on spending here, here, and here.” Then they make a plan, which might not involve a job change tomorrow, but might mean a change in a year or two, where they cut expenses, save, and re-arrange their life in a way that they can both be happy. Granted, each side needs to be flexible (but isn’t that being married?) so, yes, spouse A might have to slog through another year and might not be able to take that $30,000 a year dream job but instead settle on something still demanding but closer to $110,000 and less terrible than BigLaw job, and yes, spouse B might have to cut out classes, hobbies, cut back on the domestic help’s hours (or cut them altogether), and maybe they need to sell their house and move someplace less expensive. But if a couple doesn’t love each other enough to make these sacrifices to make the other person happy and to make the home a happy, loving place to be, then this couple has no business being married, kids or no kids.
I think that the nasty tone is pure sour grapes – some women are having more career traction than some men. Since this is a recent phenomenon, it’s being recharacterized as emasculation by the disgruntled.
Fortunately, there is no Eggshell Ball Rule, in tort or anywhere else.
Word.
My husband and I got married just 8 months ago, but we weren’t operating on the “Provider” model. We were working on the “Both-Spouses-Are-Working-Like-Donkeys” model. A model that I created for myself before getting married.
Biglaw began to get to me — Will’s posts accurately described all the emotions and thoughts I went through before and during my transition out of law. Instead of breaking apart this Provider model, though, I had to come to grips that I wouldn’t live up to “my” expectations (mostly my family’s expectations) that I’d drive around in a beamer and walk around in Jimmy Choos.
Luckily my husband was there to support me. We did exactly what you described: We sat down together before I left the firm, we planned out all of our financials, set out a budget, and set to working on our goals. We’ve adjusted our lifestyles, cut back on our spending — saving money is now like a game for me, scouring for coupons, etc.
And the best part is that I’m more present for my husband, which is what I’ve always really wanted — not the Jimmy Choos.
I don’t really see the nasty tone – the difference between men and women here is that men are expected by society and their wives to just grin and bear it, no matter how bad it is (and no one who hasn’t been there really appreciates how bad that can be). Women, on the other hand, are the exception when they’re the provider, and may be seen as weird, but are not seen as *failures* like men are when they don’t want to play that role anymore. Something to be negotiated, sure, but we can pretend gender roles don’t have an effect here.
Most men would have trouble complaining to their friends, let alone the wife herself, if they were at home with the kids and their wives wanted to make career changes to make less money and regain their sanity. In reversed roles, many wives on the other hand do not hesitate to put their respective feet down. (Or they simply keep spending – a close friend of mine was driven to divorce and bankruptcy in part because his wife left her job and then just kept spending like she hadn’t; she then got custody of the kid and lived off the money for years. Happens every day, but how often do you see men living off child support and alimony from women? There is a real societal difference in treatment – the provider wife is an anomaly, the provider husband is laden with expectation.)
The “nasty tone” was directed at the commenters who think they can “have it all” with no suffering and who were deriding their stay-at-home husbands.
I was not deriding the “provider mom” phenom; rather, I am intruiged by it and the consequences of the social order being flipped. Men traditionally were brought up (at least my generation) to believe that their self-worth was based off of what they could produce and that if they followed the rules, worked hard, and took calculated risks, they would suceed in the world. Your job was your identity. Working hard provided you and your family security. That is no longer a realistic expectation. That is why this depression is particularly hard on middle-aged men ….without a job, without the ability to produce, a man is nothing. Yes, many professional men out of work are willing to play Mr. Mom–but many I know that do have lost all ambition to do anything else with their lives. They are not needed to provide; they don’t have any purpose other to provide day-care.–Deep down inside, they resent that and hate themselves for it.
Honestly, the old “job is identity” thing was sad, tragic and in hindsight, pathetic. My dad and his cohort were like that – when they retired, or were bought out 20+ years ago, it was like they had lost limbs or family members. They’re just friggin jobs, people. Life is so much bigger than that.
Your job is still pretty much an identity and status signifier in modern America.
For example, “stay-at-home-dad” apparently means that you have no status or identiy. So it tends to confuse people. People then avoid you because of this. Sometimes they presume you are lazy and/or worthless.
However, if you self-identify as “doctor”, people will want to be your friend because you have identified as high status and you are perceived to be important. Plus people can call you in medical emergencies, making you the “kind of friend to have”.
Titles like “therapist” is tricky. Some people immediately presume that you are “strange,” so it really depends on the person. However, if you are a consumer of therapy, you might perceive that person as higher status.
The list goes on and on…
I work in a BigLaw firm in Manhattan and have done so for 14 years. I understand and can relate to everything in this blog post. Life is about choices and choices have consequences. Four years ago I made a change in my career and am much happier, though the change was scary at first. And eight years ago I left a horrible, loveless and stressful marriage.
It’s up to you. It’s your life and your choice to make. Just remember, for all we know we only live once.
This is how all strivers, try hards, gunners, nerds, grade monger geeks, backstabbing academics, ivory tower frauds, judgmental “intellectuals”, arrogant wannabe professors, biglaw douchebags, and worthless indviduals will and deserve to end up.
Why? Because we were memorizing the UCC when everyone else was out getting hammered? Because we worked hard, got good grades, and wanted to improve our lot in life beyond that which our parents gave us? Because we were smart, ambiguous, dedicated, and hardworkers? Its not our fault we bought into and followed a system that turned out to be a fraud.
Meanwhile, the “everyone’s my friend” class clown, C’s Equal JD’s lazy, entitled blue blood wins because he can bring in the most business, even though his legal work is crap and winds up involving his clients in unecessary lawsuits.
don’t make excuses for being a tryhard aspie. I’m not a blueblood and harvard grads are the worst people on the planet.
Stuff the UCC where it belongs striver, you’re the worst humanity has to offer.
LOL. Sounds like someone blames their lack of success on everyone else! Poor you, I know, I know, those people who try and succeed are terrible, it’s just not fair! Don’t worry, we don’t hold it against you, we know it’s not your lack of trying but your lack of ability that holds you back. Everything will be ok. Now go get me some coffee Lennie and then we can finish our talk later, I promise.
This little fable is interesting and I know there are a lot of men (and Provider wives) in this situation. And I sympathize, because it certainly can suck. However, there are some things to consider here:
– Having kids is hard, whether you work or stay home. Let’s be honest, very often it sucks. It is grueling, relentless work that is pretty thankless. There are plenty of women, working and non-working, who also want to get in the car and drive away and never look back. That’s not unique to Providers.
– No one said that having kids and a marriage and a cute house and reliable cars and a job was going to be fun or easy. In fact, study after study has shown that marital happiness and life happiness is at its lowest ebb when a couple has small children. The good news? Every day the sun comes up and goes down and your kids get a little older. The hard times aren’t permanent.
– I think that everyone can agree that children being in daycare 50+ hours a week is not a good idea, and there are studies that prove that, actually. So, in order to not have kids spend 50+ hours a week in daycare, someone has to flex their schedule, go part-time, or otherwise work less. It’s very difficult to find part-time professional work. Many times it is cheaper to have someone stay home full-time rather than work a part-time, low-wage job. I understand it’s hard to be a sole provider and have the weight of the family resting on your shoulders. But ask yourself one question: Do I really feel my kids would be happier, healthier, and turn out better if they had to spend 50+ hours a week in daycare, so my spouse could work a comparable job to mine? It really should be about the kids, what is best for them. You chose to have kids. Now it is not about you. “Taking one for the team” is never more applicable than when you have small children. Again, it is temporary. They will grow up and leave and if you have not raised them right, then when they are 18 your problems are not over, they are just beginning.
– However, ultimately, if your job is making you want to die, go to your spouse and say “My job makes me want to die. I have to do something. Help me figure this out.” If your spouse really loves you, he/she will help you figure this out, including figuring out a way for you to quit or get a different job that pays less money. He/she will value you, and your happiness more than the house, the cars, the investment accounts, the jewelry, the vacations, etc. I love my husband. The last thing I ever want is for him to be miserable. I would rather sell our house and cars and move into an apartment and take a bus rather than be miserable and hate his job. Because being stressed out all the time causes heart disease and I don’t want him to die. I don’t want him to constantly want to escape our family. I don’t need a lot of stuff; I need him. If your spouse doesn’t feel that way about you, you married the wrong damn person. Sorry.
The real problem here is not one spouse sticking the other one with the support of the family. Raising a family is legitimate work, as or more important than working a paying job. The real problem is, as the Therapist pointed out, that people need too much “stuff.” Don’t look at the need for your spouse to get a new job. Look at the real need for more stuff. Less need for stuff = less need for money. And if you don’t want more kids, for Christ’s sake, get a vasectomy or a tubal ligation. There are ways to prevent constant lifestyle creep, but people need to stand up for themselves. Claim and take responsibility for your own happiness.
Wow – good stuff as always.
When I read your posts, however, I am struck by the fact that you seem to always demonize Biglaw. As someone who went to a Top 60 law school (not to brag) and has spent 17 years working in a variety of litigation jobs at small firms in 3rd & 4th tier markets, I have found that it’s the culture of the industry that is the source of the animosity, angst, etc., as opposed to it being anything endemic to big firms.
I am a a Provider wife and a partner in BigLaw. I have 3 busy kids, a stay-at-home husband-father who is incredible, and I work many hours. Fortunately, technology allows me to work from anywhere at any time, so I have flexibility. I have a solid practice and clients I like. This work can be cyclical so there are times that work is frustratingly busy–but then it lets up a bit and we breathe easier. This isn’t some sort of 50s model, it is a unique hybrid model for today’s challenges. I am very well compensated, but I rarely think about it, because I do not want the focus of my work to be the money. I have been at my firm for 18 years and I do not have any plans to leave. Clearly, this is a very different model than others have presented here. I do not normally post, but feel compelled to do so here.
So I am a biglaw refugee. I loved biglaw at first, the challenging work, the smart colleagues, the prestige. But I knew I couldn’t keep it up (my introverted personality was a bad fit) so I left to go in-house (which is better but hey there are no free rides, it’s still work and more of it all the time with layoffs and budget cuts). It sounds from forums like this that lots of people get burnt out in biglaw but I rarely find anyone willing to talk about it in person, even after they’ve moved on from biglaw. It’s just comforting to know “it’s not me, it’s biglaw” because at the time I questioned myself a lot… am I lazy, am I dumb, am I socially retarded, do I just not have what it takes…
It’s definitely not you, @why don’t people talk about this? I think that more and more, people are starting to talk about it. In my biglaw office, several people talk about it. And openly. Maybe too openly, actually. It is a tough gig, that’s for sure. I work in one of the “kindler, gentler” biglaw firms too, and it still sucks the life right out of anyone who makes it passed 2nd/3rd year associate.
I know plenty of struggling biglaw parents and I honestly don’t know how they do it. I couldn’t do it. My wife and I never wanted kids. It has nothing to do with our careers, we just have no interest in raising children, and felt that way long before law school. I read the comments on here and I wonder what is wrong with us. Why does everyone else seem to want kids and we have no interest? Not even kind of. We must be sub-human.
Still, though, we both want out of biglaw just as bad as the mommies & daddies out there….but we’re thankful, SOOOO thankful that when we come home repeatedly at 3am, exhuasted, depressed, hopeless, and angry, that it’s just each other we are responsible for.
This post is chilling, because its one of my possible futures. No kids yet, but it could go this route. I pray it doesn’t and I hope that my wife and I are strong enough and that we’ll be the “different” ones. When expectations get out of control, it would be so easy to fall into this pattern. The part about resenting the wife hurts the worst. To view the one you love as just another burden – like a client, or another partner to please. Awful. And to be viewed by the one you love as inadequate, no matter how hard you try. Crushing. That’s the whole theme of biglaw. All day at work you’re inadequate. The work you did needs redlining, it wasn’t fast enough, you missed something, make me happy, make me happy, make me happy… To come home to more of the same: you need to help tidy up, I need a new car, make me happy, make me happy, make me happy…
“That’s the whole theme of biglaw. All day at work you’re inadequate. The work you did needs redlining, it wasn’t fast enough, you missed something, make me happy, make me happy, make me happy…”
–Word. Except there is no realistic way to make anyone happy in biglaw. The best you can hope for is to not piss someone off. Quite sad when you define a “good” day as one in which you were not in imminent fear of being fired.
The two primary career goals for any attorney:
1) Don’t Commit Malpractice
2) Don’t Get Fired
I am a 30-year-old woman who worked in BigLaw, then took a break to do federal clerkships, and now am considering going back to BigLaw. I am certainly familiar with the difficulties and harsh realities of BigLaw.
That said – I have very little sympathy for the Provider. Because here’s the thing – the Provider already has a family, a wife, kids, what have you. A HOME. When he gets up in the morning, he may be tired, but he knows why he is working so hard. He may have a hard day at work, but then he gets to go HOME. He has people in his life who live with him and love him and can tell him, each and every day, that his worth is not defined solely by the strength of his memos/ motions/ arguments/ doc review. Some of us are not so lucky. No soulmate, no kids, no home to center us. We pushed ourselves through school, work, prestigious positions, all of it, only to look around and realize that the chances of marriage and kids after 30 may not be so great, and yet that is exactly what we want.
So, frankly, as someone who has dealt with BigLaw, and may go back – I think the Provider should just “get over it.” Downsize his “stuff,” return the 8-year-old’s ipad, have a frank talk with the Wife about expectations and realities, and either stay in his BigLaw job (and learn to live with it, without yelling or grumping about) or get out and do something else. Either way, the Provider should count his blessings. Take charge of his Life. Go give his Wife a kiss, and give his kids hugs, and know that there are others out there in the world who would love to be in his position.
You obviously are not married and have no kids.
“he gets to go HOME”—yeah at 10-11pm
“have a frank talk with his wife”–not if he wants sex anytime in the next 6 months
“He has people in his life who live with him and love him and can tell him, each and every day, that his worth is not defined solely by the strength of his memos”–Riiiiiight…How about coming home to a family who not so subtly lets him know that his worth is defined by how much cash he brings in..how many summer camps/music lessions/private coaching/foreign study programs/yoga classes/spa treatments he can afford.
“When he gets up in the morning, he may be tired, but he knows why he is working so hard.” Again…so far from reality. More like, he wakes up and resigns himself to the fact that he has to slog through another day at the office only to come home to a demanding wife and ungrateful spoiled kids.
Stop reading romance novels on your lunch break and try dating someone ……see how long that lasts….
You are right. I am not married and have no kids. But I really wish I were married, and I really wish I had kids. And that is not because I read romance novels, but because I think it would be wonderful to have a family to come home to (on occasion), and people to (hopefully) grow old with. Even if they are difficult to deal with sometimes.
I know it is really hard to balance everything and still stay upbeat. My only point was that it must be really nice to have those things in one’s life to balance. It must be nice to have people who love you, at your home when you walk in (even if it is late at night when you walk in, and those people are sleeping). People to be with at holidays (assuming you can steal away from the office to be with them). People to watch TV with, even.
I come home at 10 also – but to an empty apartment. I do date people, and I actually found it was easier for me to handle the hard law hours/environment back when I was in a serious relationship, because that relationship brought me joy (not all the time, but sometimes) and made the hard times easier. But dating – whether serious or casual – is not the same thing as a marriage, a commitment, a real family of some sort. That, I do not have. And may never have. But I really wish I did. Many of us would love to have that.
That is all I meant. I apologize if my tone was too harsh; envy doesn’t always bring out the best in people.
If that’s your life, no wonder you’re disgruntled. If your kids only see you as a paycheck, you’re doing something wrong. If you think it’s because that’s how your wife teaches them to think about you, you’re doing something wrong. No one should be treated that way, especially by a spouse and children. If you think that this is just how marriage is, I think you should consider the possibility that you’re in an abusive relationship. And the fact that a wife may get custody of the kids, alimony, etc. shouldn’t keep anyone in a marriage this broken (assuming, of course, that all avenues of counseling etc. have been unsuccessful in saving the relationship). No kids benefit from having a dad who’s that beaten down.
About a year ago my wife and I pushed the eject button. We left our jobs in New York (mine as an attorney at a big firm and hers in finance) and moved to small city of around 100,000. We make half what we used to, but we’re at the top of the income scale in the new city and our life has improved dramatically.
We have dinner together every night (I’m out around 6:30 or 7:00 every night) and rarely get e-mails outside of working hours. Work is still work (meaning, we still look forward to the weekends), but it’s not bad at all. Our employers actually have some respect for our time. “Unless it’s urgent, I’m not going to be able to get to that until next week” is an acceptable thing to say.
We still do interesting work too. The dollar amounts are smaller and level of complexity is lower, but we’re bigger fish in this pond; the matters we work on are really significant in our new community. I may even like it – something I never expected to say about law.
Outside of work, we made three choices in connection with the move that really make it all possible: (i) we bought a modest house without taking on much of a mortgage; (ii) we bought a used car and lease a cheap Japanese model; and (iii) I paid off my private student loans. As a result, our monthly expenses are really low and we can still save a lot without compromising our lifestyle. If my wife wants to work part time or not at all for a year or two when we have kids, we can afford it.
My point in writing all of this is just to say that it really is possible to get off the treadmill. If you’ve worked at a big firm for 5 to 7 years, chances are that you already have enough in the bank to have the lifestyle you want in a cheaper market. Your experience will open a lot of doors and life really will be better.
I don’t regret my time at a big firm. I worked insane hours, but we put away a lot of money and my experience is what allowed me to get the great gig that I have now. We paid our dues, and now were off the treadmill living a life that’s no longer dominated by our jobs.
[…] Provider,” the post is essentially a lengthy, judgmental screed that says that there’s something horribly wrong when a person endures misery at work in order to provide for their family. I can’t even figure out which section to quote; you’ll have to read the post […]
[…] Meyerhofer of “The People’s Therapist” for giving a great glimpse into the life of the “Provider.” Although the article focuses on a male attorney, in this day and age, the provider could be […]
Hi TPT
With this post, you hit hard and where it hurts. I’m in the “provider” situation. I’ve been married for almost four years and my wife and I just had a baby. She workded for a while but got fired for unfair reasons. I hate my job but can’t quit. To be honest, the only solution is the honorable death. I’m 28 but my wife will be 35 this year. Due to “timing issues” she absolutely wanted a baby, even though we do not have the money, thinking that “we’ll somehow find a solution”. I knoew we wouldn’t find a solution, but caved in because she was sad to lose her job. Truth is that she has no solution, and neither do I. We’re renting an overpriced appartment she chose for the baby. We don’t have savings and can’t save any money to buy our own appartment. I’m now stuck in a trap with only one possible exit.
Dude, you have a responsibility to your child, if nothing else to teach him or her NOT to make the same choices you made, and more importantly, your child can be FUN and an AMAZING experience to take part in if you let him/her be. S/he may bring love to your life that has been missing – don’t be so fixated on how your job sucks that you miss out on the greatest experience of human existence.
I know how you feel – I go every day to a job I absolutely despise, and wake up many days praying for an earthquake or fire or terrorist strike or other disaster that will destroy my employer (and the entire Bay Area for that matter as long as it takes my employer down with it) and I can skip going to that ####ing hellhole that day, but my one year old is my respite. You need to get in there and feel that love – it will develop and grow and in another few months, nothing in the world will make you leave that child.
One thing you NEED to do though is to set your wife straight – if you are so miserable that you are suicidal, s##t needs to change, even if it means being without income and living in a tent. Paying for an overpriced apartment? Tell her F##K NO – you need to change gears completely to a lifestyle you can pay for on a job working at McDonalds, so that you can have the freedom to quit your grind and take that job if need be.
Wow. I’m a provider wife and this article and many of the posts are quite upsetting, for a few reasons.
I love my child and former full-time dad husband who has recently gone to work as a carpenter (he loves it and his days end early enough for him to pick up the little one from day care). I do get stressed out at work and generally suffer from lack of sleep, but I have NEVER thought about walking away from my family. I work hard but life is good. The time I spend with my child is quality time–and he’s well adjusted, knows I love him, and always has me or dad at his side (except when at pre-school, which he loves).
My life isn’t perfect and my husband, usually unfairly, bears the weight of my stress. But I’m working on that–without meds!
Do I feel like a wage-slave often? Yes. Do I dream about winning the lottery and never working for anyone else again? You bet. But guess what–some people struggle and work 2 mind-numbing, minimum wage jobs and still can’t make ends meet. My work is interesting, challenging, and more than provides for us. Granted, I don’t see myself doing the big-firm thing forever but I always plan to have a career in law. Off the Treadmill’s post sounds like a great path to me.
And to everyone who feels trapped by dreams of the big house and Mercedes– do you really expect sympathy? How shallow. If you’re sacrificing your life for material things and to conform to the expectations of your peers, you have only yourself to blame. (I won’t criticize private school because I loved it and it can make all the difference–it did for me.)
I don’t mean to be judgmental, but coming from a background where I saw many of my family members struggle just to barely get by, much of these complaints seem to ignore that so many people work really hard for so much less.
I know I’m late to comment on this post, but I was curious if Will (or any reader) had any tips, tools, or other resources to help stem the tide of resentment that I think is at the heart of the “drive away feeling.” My wife just decided to stay home with our two kids and I find myself growing in my anger and resentment for her. I don’t want that, like your post says I want kids and a family but I don’t want to only see my kids in the pajamas and on weekend nights. I fear that I will eventually grow to resent my wife for requiring me to stay in this job (or any job that sustains us based on my income alone).
Like I said, sorry for the late comment and any assistance is appreciated.
Did she make this decision unilaterally (as in, I don’t like working, and the legal system will make you support me no matter what, which is always in the back of their minds now whether they admit it or not, so f##k you), or did you discuss it and mutually agree that it was ok first?
Perhaps you can negotiate to keep her professionally current (make sure she keeps training and contacts for her own career) and then to swap roles in a few years? (Of course, that only works if she will honor the agreement to do it – it she won’t, maybe she’s not worth keeping, though divorce is hard on all involved.)
Is she aware of these feelings?
The decision was complicated. I left a national firm in Kansas City, and moved to a smaller market so that we could be closer to her family. The expectation was that if I did not like my job after a year, I could see what else was out there and she would hold off on the stay at home thing. At the time we only had one child (her’s from a first marriage). I quickly realized that my job wasn’t the right fit, but by that time we were pregnant and she pretty much had it in her mind that you cannot have two working professionals with two kids.
She is aware of these feelings and is trying, but I cannot help and read Will’s post, and now my own recounting of the events and see the resentment dripping off each word.
We are seeing a counselor but it seems like all we do is talk about the same things which is maddening.
That sounds to me like the decision was unilateral – did you actually discuss how this would work before she got pregnant with your own child this time? Is she committed to not working again until some time in particular (the kids are in school, they graduate from school, never, or …)?
You need to work through the resentment somehow or it may very well chew up your marriage, and IMHO, one possible path through is a commitment on her part to go back to work when the kids go to school, something you can mark off with Xs on a calendar – indicating that you are willing to stick it out to support her in this special time, but you should not be stuck in a job you hate supporting her indefinitely and that this situation will need to change, with a date certain by which that can happen (and preferably not a date 18 years from now).
Unfortunately I know more than one guy whose wife told him she’d go back to work after her maternity leave was over, then unilaterally decided not to and effectively stuck him in the role of sole provider on purpose and indefinitely (including two of my best friends – one of whom was divorced not long afterward). If this pattern is your concern, I think you need to voice it to her and let her know that forcing you into this position will be a destructive force in your psyche, your marriage and in the lives of the children, and that if she loves you, she will understand that making you a slave to supporting her is not a loving act.
Of course, this could also all just go away if you just found a better job – perhaps one that paid much less, but didn’t make you miserable. The kids need a happy and well adjusted father more than they need new Nikes every couple of months.
In today’s life lesson, we learn that many women want to stay home with their children after they are born, regardless of their prior opinion on the matter.
In tomorrow’s life lesson, we will learn something else. Perhaps that people generally enjoy eating candy. Or that alcohol can give you a buzz.
No need to be harsh JonLaw2 – I’m sure Jtron feels like an idiot as it is. A *real* cynic might think she got pregnant with his kid to make sure he was obliged to support her and the kid from the other marriage no matter what. But let’s assume for the moment she was not so conspiring.
If he wants to save his sanity and his marriage, and perhaps even his relationship with his kids, he needs to confront his feelings head on and surface them to her in a productive rather than destructive way and work out a solution – feeling trapped and betrayed is no way to live, and divorce would be unpleasant, expensive, and highly damaging for all involved, especially the kids.
[…] Provider,” the post is essentially a lengthy, judgmental screed that says that there’s something horribly wrong when a person endures misery at work in order to provide for their family. I can’t even figure out which section to quote; you’ll have to read the post […]